The Military Draft: A Moral Abomination »
Posted by: populist 11 months, 3 weeks ago318 Comments Report this Story
Forcing someone to work for the state; forcing someone to kill or be killed; forcing someone to do anything at the point of a gun - under threat of prison or even death - IS involuntary servitude. Of all the forms of slavery that have existed throughout history, forcing someone to fight and die in war is by far the most disgusting, and is a form of
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Comments So Far: 318
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MuskyMax11 months, 3 weeks ago
very interesting article... I like the way it shows points about this tricky debate!
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DanmLiberals11 months, 3 weeks ago
So you are saying we should work for you and pay taxes so you can mooch off our money and be a couch potato all day smoking pot. Your, right it does sound like YOU DEMOCRATS. Make sure the black have Welfare, the Mexicans have green cards, the gays have marriage, Muslims have a place to pray in the airport.
What do hard working American's get...... More ****** taxes. Thanks DEMOCRAPS. Just doing the stuff you want.
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Goppy11 months, 3 weeks ago
I agrees!
Them democraps is shifless and lazy!
Not liek us Republicans!
We have a history of hard work, rejectin handouts, discipline, rejectin drink and drugs, and patriotic military service!
Just liek our ideeological heero - Goerge W. Bush!!
Why - hes an absoulte perfect example of how true we are to all our beliefs about ourselfs!!
I especially liek the way Goergie made his way to the presdiency all by hisself - without any help from his family money and influence.
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ETproductions11 months, 3 weeks ago
TheGoracle, What's this about TAXES then? How many Americans pay taxes because they just want to? Don't they do it because they have to pay or go to jail? Seems to this Democrat that all laws would be out the window if we accepted that forcing someone to do something by threat of violence or imprisonment is a moral abomination.
We would be electing to abandon the rule of law altogether and replace it with the wonderful freedom of Europe in the Dark Ages or present time Somalia's rule of the biggest and best-armed group of thugs.
Put in that context, I don't think many Republicans or Democrats would support the notion that everyone should be totally free to do what ever they please; rob banks, murder, rape and pillage.
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schillinfl111 months, 3 weeks ago
Reading the Goppy and Goracle exchange, the first thing that came to mind was dumb and dumber.
Goppy is definately Jim Carey.
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ballbuster211 months, 3 weeks ago
TheGoracle, you would be the perfect IDOT! if everybody thought like you, there would not be a united states or a free society as we know it today fool.
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hoppy11 months, 3 weeks ago
eh,ahem, and are you going to be ready to pay all that extra "Sit on my Fat A--" tax that Hillary cannot help but rely upon for her insane government programs that reward the lazy and tax the middle class?
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funnyplanetComment removed: User banned.
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Goppy11 months, 3 weeks ago
Ahh, excuse me, but ... only us Christian Conservatives can talk bout moral abomination.
Heres how we work it.
Everthing liburals do is morrally offensive.
Everything Conservatives do is morally superieur.
Liek for instance, Abu Grahib..
It was morally offensive for the guy to spill his guts and talk bout the torture.
But it wasnt morally offensive to torture - cause that was done with GWs blessin. And GW is a borned again Christian.
Does any of you EVER hear from Conservative Christians condeming Abu Grahib?
NOPE!!
See, us Conservative Christians are unimpeachibly selective in whuts moral and whut aint.
Thats why you libbies calls us ignorant hypocrits. See?
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cheif11 months, 3 weeks ago
And yet, another shining example of why we need to trash the public school education system with an empty garbage can - at least we'll get some use out of the garbage can...
To the author of the article: involuntary servitude was banned to stop the practice of enslaving Irish people. There was a fight between the black slave trade and the Irish slave trade - the black slavers were angry because the Irish were practically free after involuntary servitude was banned - the blacks were expensive and you had to feed/clothe them. If an Irish slave died, they just ordered another one...ever wonder where all the people who won't allow outsiders to come into their communities in the mountains of N.C., Kentucky, Tennessee and Virginia? Descendents of runaway Irish slaves.........
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DanmLiberals11 months, 3 weeks ago
No ******. Goppy is probably the most annoying person on Netscape. By the way Goppy, the first search I did gave me this site
http://www.christianpost.com/article/20070312/2...
Maybe you should do a little research and stop being such a ignorant prick. Not everyone likes George Bush and you should look at the poles once and a while.
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ETproductions11 months, 3 weeks ago
Your rong. The Goop doan do know weevil. I's purty shore Goop has lernt dat spel chuck thing. Ain't no funnyr satyrist rightin herebouts.
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HannibalBarca11 months, 3 weeks ago
Me a con? are you totally nuts or what, I'm a pinko, liberal, socialistist Canadian RIG PIG who drills for your oil, and by the way we are beating the Russians again, 3-0 for Canada
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david_nwpa11 months, 3 weeks ago
I would have less trouble with a draft IF and only IF they would allow people of age to be drafted, to choose voluntarily to enter the Peace Corps, or AmeriCorps. I think some form of civil service would be acceptable, even beneficial for the country. However, conscripting young men (and women) for service in the armed forces is not much better than the British Navy back in the 1750s. They would grab any young men they could find in port, get them drunk, haul them on board, and lo and behold, they were in the service of the crown.
Good article.
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mark-stevens11 months, 3 weeks ago
I grew up with the draft... also grew up fearing nuclear war. Life is tough... moving right along!
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ETproductions11 months, 3 weeks ago
I don't favor a draft, but I strongly believe in a Compulsory National Service plan. Everyone who is able would serve their country. Everyone fit for military service would have to go through basic training at a minimum.
There would be pay and educational benefits to those who choose the military path after basic. But service could also be satisfied in the Peace Corps, health care, infrastructure construction and repair, environmental cleanup, alternative energy research (for those qualified), education, natural disaster recovery, any federal government program that requires a large commitment of manpower.
Because all go through basic, all could be quickly called up if there were ever a WWIII that was not a nuclear holocaust. And because all could be called up, the American people would not be so easily led into a war of opportunity again.
Another plus is that any young person not able or interested in college could learn a valuable trade while serving their country.
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JohnQPublicComment removed: User banned.
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disraeli11 months, 3 weeks ago
I can see that there may be positive benefits to a draft. For example, if there was a draft in place now, such that anyone and everyone's child could potentially end up in Iraq, perhaps that would motivate people to take to the streets and bring and end to Iraq and the other imperialist fantasies harbored by the current administration.
The downside is, as the author points out, the manpower resource made available through a draft, in the hands of the current crazed Commander in Chief, might very well be used to impose the American way on all those pesky independent countries that don't quite think the same way as King George. And as near as I can tell there is only one way that George knows how to promote the benefits of American society abroad - by destroying the infrastructure of the country in question and killing large numbers of it's citizens. Kind of a hard sell approach.
So on balance perhaps no draft is the best way to go.
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markmawn211 months, 3 weeks ago
There will be no draft, though a part of me wishes there would be just to get kids off their self-indul... slacker lifestyle. The problem is a drafted army is not a stakeholder army. That's why a hired army (SoF) is preferred, even over a volunteer army. They do not have any moral obligation, or any allegiance to our country's values. They receive a big check, and they kill anything that moves.
Hey, let's start the draft just to stir the pot a little.
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natashas11 months, 3 weeks ago
I will never believe in the draft.
Not everyone should have a gun and go into battle.
Even the people who volunteer for service find out how hard it is to live with the memories of what they see and hear each day.
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AntiNeoCon11 months, 3 weeks ago
RFE not likely you will ever find a rich kid in a combat area. Didn't happen in WWII, Korea, Viet Nam, or Iraq. You see the recruiting going on near high schools, and colleges where people are struggling to maintain..they offer the poor folk a bonus to serve, of course you have to live to spend it.
You won't see recruiters in the plush areas and well off neighborhoods.
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chiefss11 months, 3 weeks ago
Spoken by someone with ZERO military experiance. I spent 27 years n the submarine navy and I don't have any of these "bad" memories you whine about. As a matter of fact the memeories of the time I spent in the military is mostly fond memories.
"Have a gun and go into battle???" I never carried a gun into battle or anywhere else. Of course what we carried was a little more damaging. Like up to 16 megatons of hydrogen bombs. Never lost a minute of sleep over it.
Having a draft doesn't mean getting drafted. You can always join the Navy, Air Force, Coast Guard or Reserves. That's what we smart ones did.
Let's see, killing someone if you are drafted is bad but if you volunteer it's good???
Nope the rich ones joined the Navy or Air Force or went to college and got commisions.
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AntiNeoCon11 months, 3 weeks ago
Chiefs, I was in the USAF...most of us came from average homes. There were a few with rich parents, but they were scarce..there may have been a couple in the army or marines. All in all, I don't think the military appeals to rich kids.
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MonkeyBiz11 months, 3 weeks ago
As a conscript from the Vietnam era, I can state from personal experience that conscription caused a good deal of pain and resentment to the conscripts.
Almost all who went into combat came home scarred either mentally, physically or both. We at least have decent health care now and are no longer considered pariahs by so many.
A draft is not only unconstitutional, but puts many otherwise loyal citizens in conflict with their government.
I like the idea of a volunteer national service. Remove the coercion and offer meaningful rewards. A young person could choose to join the military or some other government service like the peace corp or maybe even a modern CCC. Those that complete the service should be rewarded with a WWII type GI bill for their education, housing assistance, medical etc. along with civil service hiring preferences and any other rewards that would be appropriate.
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chiefss11 months, 3 weeks ago
I am a Viet Nam Era Vet and I have many friends who were draftees and they did not come home scarred mentally and few physically.
The draft is unconstitutional?? Just where is the constitution does it mention the draft?
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populist11 months, 3 weeks ago
{The draft is unconstitutional?? Just where is the constitution does it mention the draft?}
That statement shows how limited your understanding of the constitution actually is. Let's start with the 10th amendment:
"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."
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IanFraigun11 months, 3 weeks ago
Draft is not specifically mentioned. Unfortunately a draft is involuntary servitude and that is specifically mentioned in ammendments to the constitution.
Often the draft has wasted talents that may have served better in other ways.
Going back my father was drafted in during WWII. He was 27 married with 1 child and another on the way at the time. He was truly blind in one eye without his glasses. He was taken by the Navy only because he had experiece working in the chemical industry and had completed a chemistry thesis in college though had not graduated at the time.
Well he was taken from a company involved with the Manhattan project and wound up spending the war as a payroll clerk on Treasure Island in the middle of San Francisco bay.
Miss use of skills like that is why 'Military Intelligence' is considered an oxymoronic term.
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JohnQPublicComment removed: User banned.1 Reply
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edromar211 months, 3 weeks ago
So. what is there to debate? Only a moral moron would think that any form of slavery--and thwqt is what a draft is is possibly legitimate! And thqt is the worst form of slqvery in which a person is made to violqte all standards od decency for fear of their lives. Only s motsl nit wit thinks that killing for a state is better thwn wny other form of murder. Killinf in the direct defense of the innocent who offer no danger to others is another thing. BUT, THAT IS NOT A TRUE DESCRIPTION OF MOST MODERN WARFARE--SUCH AS SENDING OUR OCCUPATION FORCES TOI iraq to kill their people because of some paranoid passion for pre-emptionj. OUR JUDGES AND PROSECUTORS WERE RIGHT AT THE Nuremburg tRIALS WHERE WE HELD IT TO BE A CAPITAL OFFENSE FOR ALL gERMAN SOLDIERS TO BE GUILTY OF MURDER FOR DOING THEIR 'duty" in Hitler's "premptive war" Hitler also would have been convicted and sentenced to capital penalties if he had lived to face his accusers.
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edromar211 months, 3 weeks ago
9CONTINUED) May all men who led countries into preemptive wars face such a rightful punishment. And may all fools who claim to have followed out of duty or fear for their own lives to take those of others face equal penalties.
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