Join the Discussion

Comments So Far: 288

• 0%

  deathray1 year ago

  If these interrogation techniques constitue torture, then the CIA, the Justice Department, and the White House owe the American people and the subject of these interrogation techniques more than merely an explanation and an apology.

  Reply

  25 Replies

  • 0%

    Aidenag1 year ago

    What they deserve is jail time.. but lets show them how its properly done. No torture, no coerced statements, let them see what its suppose to be like in the USA.

    Reply

    3 Replies

    • 0%

      hamy1 year ago

      Sorry! Wrong button! Hang Dick and George high! They are the true terrorists. They have made us stoop to their level. We will never recover from this black eye Bush's administration has given us. The world sees us as murderers.

      Reply

      1 Reply

      • 0%

        alxnsc1 year ago

        hamy,

        Some fix is necessary. The world does not see this that way. Some may do, most do not as they know Americans are not murderers.

        It is up to the Great American people, up to the brave and up to the free to prove it and wash the dirty torture spit off the noble face of an honourable, highly respected, most straightforward and honest nation.

        The torture topic is so broadly dicussed to provoke hatred towards the American people, to build up this people a disgusting image, to make others fight the most brutal way and to make Americans respond this same way.

        Gunfodder guaranteed. Profeteers are gaining profit on tortures, wars and dirt...

        Reply
    • 0%

      godnews6 months, 3 weeks ago

      http://pic.gwafi.com http://games.gwafi.com http://myweb.gwafi.com

      Reply
  • 0%

    koranagirl1 year ago

    Deathray, thank you so very much for posting this so we can see what a group of scoundrels there are in power now, but the reality is the Red Cross, Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch and other large, credible NGO's have been documenting and sending vociferous demands to the White House that all this is clearly illegal and has to stop. This has happened from just a month or two after we invaded Afghanistan way back in early 2002 and I don't believe it has stopped yet.

    I don't know why the people that directed the torture are not in jail and removed from office. It has been years now since many were tortured, brutalized, even killed, but nothing happens as a result. Reports of reliable NGO's go on deaf ears. Reports by whistleblower soldiers, mercenaries and contractors as to the torture, severe prisoner mistreatment, death of innocent civilians goes unheard of and unnoticed.

    Reply

    17 Replies

    • 0%

      Locky121 year ago

      It's all in the name of National Security. And it's 1000% fine by this taxpayer.

      Reply

      15 Replies

      • 0%

        HateKoolAid1 year ago

        To paraphrase Benjamin Franklin; He who sacrifices liberty for security deserves neither. He was referring to people like you Locky.

        Reply

        8 Replies

        • 0%

          ETproductions1 year ago

          Not only does he deserve neither. Nations that sacrifice liberty for security GET neither. Germany under Hitler. Italy under Mussolini. Russia under Stalin. North Korea under Kim Il-sung. China under Mao. Cambodia under Pol Pot. Russia again today under Putin.

          Why are the Radical Right blind to the fact that their own government is closer, more powerful and a lot more of a potential threat than some guys hiding in caves in Pakistan?

          The number one problem facing America today is the restoration of Constitutional Law, and it's not even on the agenda of any candidate except Ron Paul.

          Reply

          7 Replies

          • 0%

            tiredofwhiners1 year ago

            When I find out I can't vote anymore I'll believe you. I doubt that Stalin or most of the dictators you mention were voted in by true democratic elections. I'll take my government over the cave dweller. The constitution has already been changed by you libs and your ACLU to the point it is barely recognizable. P.S. I'm looking for 0-15. I didn't neg you because you made a clear statement of your opinion and without name calling!! Oh, and I like Ron Paul.

            Reply

            6 Replies

            • 0%

              DeadXXXManXXXTalkin1 year ago

              ''When I find out I can't vote anymore I'll believe you''

              by then it will be too late. what happened to the 'we need to stop the muslim hordes before they get too strong like we needed to stop hitler before he got too strong prevention worth a pound of cure' rhetoric?

              each journey begins with single steps. don't expect totalitarianism to just start tap-dancing on your forehead one morning

              or as my brother-in-law says, 'jump in a tub of too hot water and you jump right back out-but what if the water is heated while you're in it, a degree every hour? At what point do you scream?'

              Reply

              2 Replies

              • 0%

                dissent1 year ago

                The Slow Boiling Frog Story. Unknowingly acclimatizing to fascism.

                Reply
              • 0%

                Charlson1 year ago

                I think 65% of the people are intelligent enough in the US to realize what was happening and try to get out. It's the 35% that will boil.

                Reply
            • 0%

              lfergie8121 year ago

              "When I find out I can't vote anymore I'll believe you."

              What do you think happened to thousands of people that tried to vote in the last two presidential election?? Polls for some people were so congested that people could not get in to vote and for many their names were removed from the rolls so they had to cast a provisional ballot which wasn't counted. In other polling places, the polls were closed before everyone had a chance to vote even though the election board was at fault. So they were in reality denied the right to vote and it could happen to you.

              Constitution changed by libs?? Hardly. The ACLU, whether you like it or not, is doing what they think is meant in the Constitution. If they were wrong, they would have lost their cases. I personally don't like everything that they have done but I can accept it.

              Reply

              1 Reply

              • 0%

                dissent1 year ago

                Reminds me of my dad. Whenever I was driving and he was in the passenger seat of my car he had this peculiar habit of stomping hard on an imaginary brake pedal every few seconds. I used to joke about putting in a dummy pedal just to keep him happy. Voting is now just about the same and just as effective as a dummy brake pedal. It makes you think you're having an effect when it's really beyond your control.

                Reply
            • 0%

              SpareChange1 year ago

              tired

              You obviously have no idea what the ACLU does. You obviously care more about party politics than the constitution.

              Torture is Unamerican.

              Reply
      • 0%

        gamahuche1 year ago

        Perhaps you should volunteer as a torturer.

        Then when everything comes around, as everything does, you can be on the receiving end too.

        IF you survive that then please come back and tell us which you enjoyed more - giving or receiving.

        On tne meantime, if you want to put your money where your mouth is, you should send regular large checks to the WH torture fund.

        That would indeed make you a fine taxpayer.

        Reply
      • 0%

        mcgrievysr1 year ago

        Locky12----Paranoia and delusion running amok.

        Reply
      • 0%

        PapaWolf1 year ago

        Locky12

        >>It's all in the name of National Security. And it's 1000% fine by this taxpayer.

        So when another country deems you a threat, kidnaps you out of your nice midwestern (or wherever) home, extraordinarily renders you to a 3rd country, and you're tortured & abused to strengthen this other country's national security, you won't have a problem with that. Right?

        Or, if W for some odd reason decides that YOU are an enemy combatant because of a misread eMail you sent to someone - possibly as a joke - & you're shipped to Gitmo & tortured, you'll be honored to have been sacrificed in the name of National Security. Correct?

        Reply

        1 Reply

        • 0%

          Bruedaddy1 year ago

          those are the same people who think not having Habeas Corpus is no problem....

          yeah, it's a problem.

          Reply
      • 0%

        jordan111 year ago

        Locky: I know you didn't read the NYT article, & it was so long I'll bet few did. The stupid paper should have at least narrowed down this point;

        The CIA torture teams feared reprisals because they were illegally told to torture people, and they knew it was illegal.

        So they sent the suspects to Saudi's and Egyptians....contracted with them, actually. Using MY $$$.

        In 2002, gonzales sent the CIA the 'bibee' memo (sp), saying in his 'opinion' torture was legal.

        Bush loved that gonzo went along with his plans, & wanted to make him attorney general. But gee, Congress wasn't in a good mood about the torture stuff, so two days before New Years Eve, of 2004, bush told his famous lie that we don't torture, we don't solicit other country's for torture, blah blah blah.

        In 05, Gonzales was confirmed, everyone feeling confidant that the 'torture' issue was behind us.

        Two weeks later, gonzales reinstated torture, SECRETLY. In a memo, he told the CIA to ignore Congress.

        Reply

        1 Reply

        • 0%

          jordan111 year ago

          Continued: IGNORE CONGESS! THE BODY THAT MAKES OUR LAWS! THIS PIECE OF DIRT TOLD THE CIA TO IGNORE ITS OWN GOVERNMENT! HE PUT HIMSELF ABOVE OUR LAWS!!! HE BROKE OUR LAWS!!! You don't like our laws, locky? What does that make you, locky? Can you guess? What would you call a person who tries to usurp his government, locky? hmmmm?

          Reply
    • 0%

      Bruedaddy1 year ago

      I don't know who you are....

      you're not the same person posting the other day...

      I actually agree with everything you said....

      WOW.....

      Reply
  • 0%

    gamahuche1 year ago

    DR - I'm certain that you means subjectS in your opening statement.

    Not nitpicking - it shifts the meaning considerably.

    Reply

    2 Replies

    • 0%

      deathray1 year ago

      Yes, that's correct. Thanks for the clarification. You all know I can't type.

      Reply

      1 Reply

      • 0%

        gamahuche1 year ago

        That's why I thought I should make a typo on my msg too! :)

        Reply
• 0%

  Beau78901 year ago

  From the article:

  "A White House spokesman, Tony Fratto, said Wednesday that he would not comment on any legal opinion related to interrogations. Mr. Fratto added, "We have gone to great lengths, including statutory efforts and the recent executive order, to make it clear that the intelligence community and our practices fall within U.S. law" and international agreements."

  How does a "recent executive order" legalize these practices that have occurred since 2005? And to which stautory efforts does Fratto refer? More secret ones?

  Reply
• 0%

  Locky121 year ago

  They're not U.S. Citizens and they are suspected of trying to kill us.

  A little head-slapping and head dunking never killed anybody. But it may just save a few thousand lives.

  You people worry too much.

  Reply

  59 Replies

  • 0%

    Locky121 year ago

    ...and over the wrong stuff.

    Reply

    53 Replies

    • 0%

      dunkirk1 year ago

      ROFLMAO yet Im sure slapping people around and dunking them are making us tons of friends in the war against terror. Yeah why I bet if that happened to you you;d be apologizing left and right that you were so sorry you were going about your normal life and that made them suspicious and how sorry you were that you made them slap you around and dunk you, even when you havent done anything.

      Reply

      32 Replies

      • 0%

        Locky121 year ago

        Guy, they aren't U.S. Citizens and suspected of trying to kill you. Not just rounded up at random! There's a reason for the stop!

        If one of them was let go and killed one of your family members you'd be the first to scream and cry, "Why didn't they connect the dots! Why didn't they get him when they had the chance! I'm suing the government to make sure that never happens again!"

        Like I said, a little head dunking and head slapping never killed anybody! Where the heck were you when the Muslims were cutting off heads on TELEVISION?

        It seems they really aren't trying to become close friends with us in the first place.

        Reply

        31 Replies

        • 0%

          dunkirk1 year ago

          So can you tell us how many friends in the War of Errors it HAS won for us? Sees when all you do is go around and making more and more enemies you're creating a self fufilling prophecy.

          ROFLMAO, Home Depot is having a duct tape and plastic sheet sale this weekend. Better stock up.

          Oh and dont forget to look behind your bushes they could be hiding ebverywhere.

          Reply

          14 Replies

          • 0%

            Locky121 year ago

            Not that worried.

            Reply

            13 Replies

            • 0%

              dunkirk1 year ago

              Not that worried???? After your posts above claim doomsday is right around the corner unless absolutely everyone is incarcerated. ROFLMAO. THe typical Bush fear pusher.

              Reply

              12 Replies

              • 0%

                GWHayduke1 year ago

                Its ideology! NOT reality, that worries people like Locky.

                He is a walking contradiction.

                Reply

                11 Replies

                • 0%

                  Locky121 year ago

                  I know enough to know that there is a real threat out there being defeated. I'm not worried about it, I just know about it. The posters on this board on the other hand think we if we all just held hands and sung Kumbaya, it would all go away.

                  Reply

                  4 Replies

                  • 0%

                    AlgoRhythm1-21 year ago

                    "The posters on this board on the other hand think we if we all just held hands and sung Kumbaya, it would all go away."

                    No one here really thinks that. Stop trying to oversimplify this into fight or flight.

                    Reply
                  • 0%

                    dunkirk1 year ago

                    "I know enough to know that there is a real threat out there being defeated"

                    Maybe you need a refresher course, under Bush and his War of Errors terrorism worldwide is up over 600%. Maybe you can explain how that is defeating it?

                    Reply
                  • 0%

                    scabbio1 year ago

                    locky, your really singing yourself into a ditch.

                    noone in this chat here is afraid. i'd venture to say most are outraged or upset or aggravated or annoyed

                    any one of these yes, but afraid?

                    you see we understand your point of view, the KGB point of view, but we don't endorse it.

                    i can see how torture would have a predictable affect on the tortured, and how a person could use this to advantage, but that doesn't justify it.

                    Reply

                    1 Reply

                    • 0%

                      Pastafari1 year ago

                      Imperialists oppress(Bushies)- the oppressed fight back(Terrorist). It's a simple equation really; Imperialists make terrorists - you start a war on an amorphous enemy (anyone that dares question the Empires power) - Label them terrorists and you have War machine that will roll as long as the funds are shoveled in and a built in enemy that will never be vanquished given that the Empires business is to squeeze as much as it can from those it oppresses thus continually creating a endless stream of "terrorist". So if there is a threat it is the fault of those that are supposed to represent us abroad. If we say it is ok for us to use torture to "gain vital intelligence" then we are saying we can use what ever violence we want and that it is justified. While also claiming that those individuals we have labeled terrorists do not have the right to use similar violence to protect what they see as their Interests.Bush is saying, "Do as we say and not as we do"

                      Reply
                • 0%

                  Locky121 year ago

                  I'm sorry. A Head Slap IS NOT TORTURE.

                  Nor is head dunking! DROWNING IS SOMETHING COMPLETELY WRONG.

                  Reply

                  5 Replies

                  • 0%

                    dissent1 year ago

                    A prehistoric con somewhere in the ancient past must have thought the Kumbaya dig was real clever and cute because for generations of cons since they decided to kick back and do nothing having achieved the pinnacle of con evolution in that one pitiful little insult - Kumbaya. Funny, the Kumbaya mantra has today actually become the cons' Kumbaya. But rather than toasting marshmallows over the fire they're lurking in the shadows in Rambo gear and makeup waiting to blast the bogeyman. Nothing like blowing away mosquitos with automatic firearms. I guess the cons don't have too much else going on in their ho hum mediochre lives now that they have evolved to their full potential. And so, whether it be through lack of effort or inability, I can't quite tell, cons simply haven't had an original idea since then. Kumbaya to you too, Mr Locky Lock. (This was for your previous comment).

                    Reply
                  • 0%

                    dissent1 year ago

                    So if it's no big deal why all the lying and sneaking around?

                    Reply

                    3 Replies

                    • 0%

                      Locky121 year ago

                      Dissent, do you freebase oxygen?

                      Reply

                      1 Reply

                      • 0%

                        dissent1 year ago

                        hahahahahahahaha... no.

                        Reply
                    • 0%

                      gasyoun8 months ago

                      Doen't be so critical. I've changed my mind after reading http://www.yrand.com/administration-and-cabinet...

                      Reply
        • 0%

          gamahuche1 year ago

          >>>they aren't U.S. Citizens

          So anyone anywhere who is not a US citizen is a potential victim?

          Surely you also know a few US traitors, some long-term foreign US residents, a few deadly domestic enemies who would be eminently suitable for a little practice "treatment"? What's stopping you getting started?

          >>>and suspected of trying to kill you.

          On hearsay evidence?

          >>>Not just rounded up at random!

          Indeed! For the most part SOLD to the US for reward money.

          Poor people, tribal enmities, some guy wants another one's wife..

          All of these are far more likely reasons for incarceration at Guantanamo and other torture camps than any terrorist connections

          >>>a little head dunking and head slapping never killed anybody

          Indeed. But that is NOT what's been happening.

          Your lack of knowledge and information makes it sound like YOU live in a cave in a third world country.

          Reply
        • 0%

          DeadXXXManXXXTalkin1 year ago

          ''Guy, they aren't U.S. Citizens and suspected of trying to kill you. Not just rounded up at random! There's a reason for the stop! ''

          I could be wrong but this appears to be a kind of flip side to the thinking about wiretapping and privacy invasion: 'if you aren't doing anything wrong, you have nothing to worry about'

          Underlying both scenarios, rounding up non-US citizens, and listening to peoples phone calls, is a kind of 'if they are innocent they have nothing to worry about' deal, and a suspension of assumption of innocence [why arrest people or eavesdrop if you think someone's innocent?]

          Reply

          8 Replies

          • 0%

            DeadXXXManXXXTalkin1 year ago

            so you can say those people are not 'rounded up at random' [tho how you would know that I can't say] and that 'there's a reason for the stop', but this is only authoritarian faith in our government.

            Why?

            Because without a doubt we can't be sure who all these people are and what they have done, not without some sort of quasi-legal process, so how in the Billy-be-damned can you say 'there's a reason', except on faith that the government wouldn't detain, torture or annoy anybody without good cause?

            and the old, 'these guys aren't US citizens so rules schmoolz and tough titty on them' thing kind of grates on my ears like hypocrisy. 'we're here to bring you democracy and detain you at will if we feel like'? we'll give you some democracy but hands off those other trappings of liberty. we make the rules now...

            Reply

            7 Replies

            • 0%

              dunkirk1 year ago

              " not without some sort of quasi-legal process"

              But with the Patriot Act there isnt a legal process at all. Its more of at the whim.

              Reply

              3 Replies

              • 0%

                DeadXXXManXXXTalkin1 year ago

                yeah, what I was trying to say in a shorter version is, with people being detained without some kind of process to find out who they are and what they may be charged with, just on hearsay or random suspicion, you can't just say 'there's a reason' and trust that no mistakes are made. There's no basis for 'there's a reason' type thinking.

                Hey, i have my good days and bad days gray matter-wise :-)

                Reply

                2 Replies

                • 0%

                  dunkirk1 year ago

                  I agreed with you totally. I emphasized that part and added the Patriot Act as my explanation because to me THAT is what this country has above all others, the right to a defense and to hear th4e charges and present a defense and THAT is what is being stripped away by the Bushies.

                  And we all have the bad days :)

                  Reply

                  1 Reply

                  • 0%

                    DeadXXXManXXXTalkin1 year ago

                    oh, just thought i coulda expressed that more directly and in a more concise fashion. the detaining of people just for suspicion coupled with mistreatment in order to figure out why the people are being held in the first place just gives me the jim-jams and effects my cognition a little, having experienced a few things some would consider 'torture'

                    Reply
            • 0%

              PapaWolf1 year ago

              >>so you can say those people are not 'rounded up at random' [tho how you would know that I can't say]

              Because RUSH told him so....

              Reply

              2 Replies

              • 0%

                Locky121 year ago

                And what's your source that it IS random?

                Reply

                1 Reply

                • 0%

                  PapaWolf1 year ago

                  Perhaps it's the lack of prosecutions on terrorism charges of those detained.

                  Reply
        • 0%

          StarLord1 year ago

          "Guy, they aren't U.S. Citizens" - this means that they have no rights? You need to read the Universal Declaration of Human Rights sometime (yes, the USA has signed it). Please specifically read Articles 5-7.

          Article 5: "No one shall be subjected to torture or to cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment."

          Article 6: "Everyone has the right to recognition everywhere as a person before the law."

          Article 7: "All are equal before the law and are entitled without any discrimination to equal protection of the law. All are entitled to equal protection against any discrimination in violation of this Declaration and against any incitement to such discrimination."

          These are excerpts from the document itself. While it is nonbinding, it is also a benchmark for human rights generally, and considered to be an expression of hte human conscience. You do have one of those, don't you?

          Reply

          5 Replies

          • 0%

            StarLord1 year ago

            Also, please look up the book "Guantanamo: What the world needs to know". You may be surprised at the kindds of people who found their way to the other side of the barbed wire - taxi drivers in Kabul, Red Cross workers (no, not kidding) and Taliban prisoners, who the Afghan warlords handed over to the Us for cash (the USA paid USD 5,000 per live prisoner and asked no questions of the people who brought them in).

            I'm afraid that a great many of them were in fact picked up at random. Look up Sami al-Hajj. Your arguments are as bankrupt of logic as your character is of morals.

            Reply

            4 Replies

            • 0%

              Locky121 year ago

              It's a war zone. Isn't it?

              Reply

              3 Replies

              • 0%

                StarLord1 year ago

                So that justifies the picking-up of random people off the street? I think not - the practice of picking people off the street 1)is immoral and wrong, b)truns local people against the occupiers and c)wastes the time and efforts of the troops.

                Reply

                2 Replies

                • 0%

                  Locky121 year ago

                  There's nothing random about it.

                  I'm sick and tired of people on this board telling me to check my facts when NOBODY ON THIS BOARD SEEMS TO PRACTICE WHAT THEY PREACH!!!

                  Reply

                  1 Reply

                  • 0%

                    StarLord1 year ago

                    Like I said, read the book I indicated. Unless you are prepared to accuse the authors of spending four years lying, then there is cause for concern.

                    I HAVE checked my facts. Go bother someone else with your ad hominem arguments.

                    Reply
    • 0%

      jaspersneed1 year ago

      You are an absolute monster, running around free in the world. I worry about THAT.

      Reply

      19 Replies

      • 0%

        Locky121 year ago

        What you should worry about is the people that protect you and I, listening to you. They would end up letting a few go without, perish the thought, HEAD-SLAPPING a guy who's got several tons of ammonium nitrate in his basement!

        Then you'd scream: "Why didn't they connect the dots!?!" HYPOCRITE!

        Reply

        18 Replies

        • 0%

          jaspersneed1 year ago

          I sure as hell don't need some knuckle-dragging cretin's opinion on what I should or should not worry about. I know where the real threat to this country lies.

          Reply

          5 Replies

          • 0%

            Locky121 year ago

            So do I! It's people like YOU that we think the U.S. is the problem. Everybody else would love us and be our friend if only we weren't so stubborn. That my friend, would be the road to tyranny.

            Reply

            3 Replies

            • 0%

              gamahuche1 year ago

              You are losing it, Sir or Madam.

              All of your posts are entirely lacking in sense, honesty, or any redeeming human - not to mention humane - quality.

              This one is also so devoid of comprehensibility and/or logic that I fear that you are due for immediate incarceration in a mental hospital - unless indeed you are already writing to us from one..

              I do hope there's not a Locky 13 waiting in the wings to take over from you.

              Reply

              1 Reply

              • 0%

                StarLord1 year ago

                He does have certain robotic qualities - lack of capacity for thought, mindless loyalty to people that have kicked him....

                Reply
            • 0%

              djn3nunez31 year ago

              --It's people like YOU that we think the U.S. is the problem.

              Nothing could be further for the truth. The US is not hte problem. The problem is the people who hate the US across the world for what our interventionist policies have done to their countries.

              http://www.cato.org/pub_display.php?pub_id=1019...

              Head slapping, waterboarding and other atrocious acts visited on suspects in not only inhumane and goes against the spirit of the American dream but also it is likely creating more terrorists.

              Reply
          • 0%

            crghss1 year ago

            So do I. It's people like you.

            Reply
        • 0%

          Neophile1 year ago

          Maybe you should worry about the quality of the information retrieved using such methods.

          Reply

          11 Replies

          • 0%

            Locky121 year ago

            T's can be crossed and I's can be dotted at a later point when thousands of lives could be at stake. I'm not going to lose any sleep over a "head slap" or a "head dunk". Sounds like a fraternity initiation to me! Heck, it sounds a HECK of a lot better than what a Muslim would do!

            Reply

            10 Replies

            • 0%

              Neophile1 year ago

              Sounds like a bunch of tired old neocon talking points to me.

              Reply

              6 Replies

              • 0%

                bruhaha1 year ago

                That's all he's got because he obviously doesn't have anything else to support his "beliefs"

                Reply

                5 Replies

                • 0%

                  Locky121 year ago

                  Umm, no. There used to be two 102 story towers in lower Manhattan that aren't there anymore.

                  Reply

                  4 Replies

                  • 0%

                    djn3nunez31 year ago

                    umm, 110 stories. And the defeat of the group responsible for bringing them down will not be accomplished by invading and occupying oil rich Arab nations that did not participate in that attack. In fact, invading and occupying these oil rich nations seems to be having quite the opposite efffect on the Arab Muslim populations.

                    Reply

                    2 Replies

                    • 0%

                      PapaWolf1 year ago

                      But don't you all realize that it was intelligence gathered from torture victims that gave us the world-renowned & highly successful invasion & occupation of Iraq. These wonderfully reliable sources assured us of ties between Saddam & Ossama, WMD manufacturing facilities, & other information that has turned out to be 100% reliably accur.....

                      Wait. They were wrong. Weren't they?

                      But torture got the info out of them - wrong or not.

                      Reply
                    • 0%

                      StarLord1 year ago

                      Not to mention that it's doing AQ's recruiting for them.

                      Reply
                  • 0%

                    bruhaha1 year ago

                    I'm sure you've heard this before....IRAQ DID NOT ATTACK THE UNITED STATES. IRAQ (HUSSEIN) WAS a MORTAL ENEMY of BIN LADEN.

                    Even Bush was forced to admit, much to his chagrin that Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11 so stop trying to equate 9/11 and Iraq. Iraq had nothing to do with the "War on Terrorism" when it started. Bush wanted a war with Iraq and he got it.

                    Reply
            • 0%

              DeadXXXManXXXTalkin1 year ago

              the problem with the classic, 'would you torture to save lives?' scenario, which is the common defense, is no one has invented telepathy devices yet:

              how do we know the guy is guilty before we torture him? Because someone else says so?

              for that matter, how do we know the guy is guilty AFTER we torture him?

              so I reject the 'torture to save lives' rhetoric until we at least have a rudimentary mind-reading device.

              also, if its ok to torture one guy because it may save lives [point being without proof-and I guess this ties in with detaining people with no evidence or proof or charge-everyone is a potential player in the most unwanted role in that scenario] then its OK to torture anybody, 'just in case' it may save lives.

              I don't think Bush Inc. even used the 'torture to save lives' scenario defense directly. The administrational think tank probably rejected it as too tenuous and easily ground up by pedestrian logic

              like mine

              Reply
            • 0%

              StarLord1 year ago

              Forgot to address the point again? In what way is information gained via torture more reliable than otherwise?

              Reply

              1 Reply

              • 0%

                globalwarmer1 year ago

                Its not. Some intelligence officers say that many of Mr. Mohammed's statements proved exaggerated or false. One problem, a former senior agency official said, was that the C.I.A.'s initial interrogators were not experts on Mr. Mohammed's background or Al Qaeda, and it took about a month to get such an expert to the secret prison. The former official said many C.I.A. professionals now believe patient, repeated questioning by well-informed experts is more effective than harsh physical pressure.

                Reply
  • 0%

    bumbaklotartattack1 year ago

    You obviously don't know how to read. The constitution doesn't make any difference between citizen and people at large when it comes to the bill of rights, you chimp.

    Reply

    3 Replies

    • 0%

      Locky121 year ago

      Yeah, it does. There is no precedence for enemy combatant non citizens having ANY kind of protection in our courts. They have their own system and they don't need your bleeding heart sympathy.

      Reply

      2 Replies

      • 0%

        bruhaha1 year ago

        Then why has the supreme court ruled against the Bush admin several times regarding prisoners?

        Reply
      • 0%

        StarLord1 year ago

        What system do they have? Oh, that's right, the "tribunal" system, where they don't need to be proven guilty of anything, where the hearings are held secretly, where evidence gained by torture is admissable, where hearsay evidence is admissable, where the defence can be refused the right to cross-examine witnesses, where a DOJ-appointed rep can over-rule a verdict of "not guilty" for any reason or none at all......

        These "trials" are a blot on the record of US justice - I am never visiting the USA. After all, as a forigner, I have no rights and no protection from similar treatment.

        "Justice consists in doing no injury to men; decency in giving them no offense." - Cicero, Roman orator and jurist.

        Also,

        "Whenever a separation is made between liberty and justice, neither, in my opinion, is safe." - Edmund Burke, conservative philosopher.

        Reply
  • 0%

    NoWayMan1 year ago

    thats not what john mcCain says. he's against torture. and he should know.

    Reply
• 0%

  bumbaklotartattack1 year ago

  Nazis like bobo in texas and other bush-supporters don't care. Hypocrites like these idiots will gladly coerce the "enemy" in whatever means necessary to make themselves feel better. Meanwhile the fake Christian right proudly go to church on the last day rather than the sabbath day and talk about bombing more middle eastern countries while they wait for Jesus to come to them. LOL!

  Reply

  30 Replies

  • 0%

    Locky121 year ago

    Umm, no, it's the MUSLIMS that leave the Mosque on Fridays screaming "DEATH TO AMERICA" and then go and try to kill as many Christians as they can! Keep "Laughing Out Loud" at that.

    Reply

    29 Replies

    • JohnQPublicComment removed: User banned.18 Replies

      • 0%

        jaspersneed1 year ago

        He has no such links.

        Reply

        7 Replies